Elenchus

ἜΛΕΓΧΟΣ

eh-LENG-kus /əˈlɛŋkəs/. The cross-examination that catches a contradiction. Socrates made it a method. Paul brought it to this rock.

The RecordΗ·ΑΝΑΓΡΑΦΗACTA{ymyh yrbd

PersonPhilosopherSophistNetSoundnessSageStandingPoints per hourDebates
Jonathan ShelleyProtestant pastor (as introduced by the moderator) who defends the 66-book King James canon and rejects the Apocrypha Religio (Worldview) Protestant 2 Philosopher, 7 Sophist, unranked Argues by Treats scripture as his final and self-authenticating authority and tests books by the "divine voice" ("my sheep hear my voice"), internal consistency and reception; admits the position is circular Style Often answers a challenge with a counter-question about the opponent's church, and repeats the same analogies (Shakespeare versus Dr. Seuss, a wife's voice) Points per hour 2.0 Philosopher, 7.0 Sophist Measured speaks in short bursts, asks often: 1020 turns averaging 3.5 seconds, longest 29 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: evidence (1) Caught at: begging the question (2), dodge (2), ad hominem (1) 1 debate (Neos): DEBATE: Jay Dyer Vs Pastor Jonathan Shelley | Tradition Vs Sola Scriptura The whole record Jonathan Shelley27−5—5Unranked2.0 / 7.01 debate Neos
JY Lewis (caller) 1.2 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Measured speaks in short bursts, asks often: 28 turns averaging 3.3 seconds, longest 16 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: homologia (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Pastor P Debate Orthodoxy vs Protestantism, Sola Scriptura and Church History The whole record JY Lewis (caller)1.20+1.2—10Unranked—1 debate Neos
Andy WarskiAndy Warski is the pro-choice host of the live stream, who brings in callers and reads the chat. Religio (Worldview) Other (Pro-choice, while granting that abortion stops a life that would be) 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Affiliations Hosts the live show, including a segment called Kumite Style poses hard-case hypotheticals to the guests, reads paid chat questions aloud with the donor's name and amount Points per hour 6.7 Philosopher, 0.0 Sophist Measured speaks in short bursts: 189 turns averaging 2.8 seconds, longest 13 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: concession (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Styx Debate Abortion – Pro-Life vs Government Overreach The whole record Andy Warski10+1—5Unranked6.7 / 0.01 debate Neos
BiancaBianca is a 27-year-old who has just finished nursing school and is building fitness brands. 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Style speaks in short, measured statements and openly sides with the hosts Measured speaks in short bursts: 96 turns averaging 2.9 seconds, longest 20 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: steelman (1) 1 debate (Neos): HEATED Debate w/ Feminists. Wage Gap, Pro Choice ft. @MikeRashidOfficial The whole record Bianca10+1—1Unranked—1 debate Neos
Chase 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Style Asks one consistency question, then thanks the host and excuses himself Measured speaks in short bursts, asks often: 12 turns averaging 3.9 seconds, longest 12 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: explicit argument (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Ryan Dawson Debate: Theism vs Anti-Theism, Christianity vs Nihilism, Relativism, Atheism The whole record Chase10+1—7Unranked—1 debate Neos
Donatus 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Style Presses a single charge of question-begging and repeats it when answered Measured speaks in short bursts, asks often: 5 turns averaging 4.8 seconds, longest 16 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: clarification (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Ryan Dawson Debate: Theism vs Anti-Theism, Christianity vs Nihilism, Relativism, Atheism The whole record Donatus10+1—7Unranked—1 debate Neos
Father JonathanAn Orthodox priest who cohosts The Transfigured Life podcast with Luther and moderates its guest discussions. Religio (Worldview) Eastern Orthodox (implied) 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Affiliations Cohost of the podcast The Transfigured Life Argues by Prefers discussion to debate, and seeks common agreement before disagreement Style asks long multi-part questions loaded with his own argument before yielding the floor Points per hour 8.8 Philosopher, 0.0 Sophist Measured speaks in short bursts: 89 turns averaging 4.6 seconds, longest 21 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: explicit argument (1) 1 debate (Neos): Protestant vs. Orthodox: Scripture and Tradition (Gavin Ortlund + Stephen De Young) The whole record Father Jonathan10+1—1Unranked8.8 / 0.01 debate Neos
Rambling Man (caller) 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Measured speaks in short bursts, asks often: 20 turns averaging 3.0 seconds, longest 11 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: steelman (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Pastor P Debate Orthodoxy vs Protestantism, Sola Scriptura and Church History The whole record Rambling Man (caller)10+1—10Unranked—1 debate Neos
Solomon (caller) 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Measured speaks in short bursts: 32 turns averaging 1.9 seconds, longest 7 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: clarification (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Pastor P Debate Orthodoxy vs Protestantism, Sola Scriptura and Church History The whole record Solomon (caller)10+1—10Unranked—1 debate Neos
Stoner LogicStoner Logic is an anarchist YouTuber (Radio Freedom) who called in from the chat to argue that no government is needed. Religio (Worldview) Other (Anarchist) 1 Philosopher, 0 Sophist, unranked Affiliations YouTube channel Radio Freedom Style speaks slowly and hesitantly, building a point in fragments Measured speaks in short bursts: 79 turns averaging 2.8 seconds, longest 14 seconds, across 1 debate Best at: state of the argument (1) 1 debate (Neos): Jay Dyer vs Styx Debate Abortion – Pro-Life vs Government Overreach The whole record Stoner Logic10+1—1Unranked—1 debate Neos
Men of Athens, I perceive that in every way you are very religious. For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription: To the unknown god. What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you. Paul, on the Areopagus. Acts 17:22–23

Palaismata (kill shots)

The throws that ended an exchange: an argument turned, a question forced, a point settled, each one upheld by the bench as decisive.

1 of 4

“… if the son is not equal to the father because he doesn't spirate, then the spirit has to also spirate. But nobody teaches the the spirit spirates or generates a person. So by your own argument, you subordinated the spirit…”

— Jay DyerantistrephonThe Catholicism or Orthodoxy DEBATE: Tim… at 1:32:38

1 of 4

“But you say you know how females think though. You did say that.”

— KimberlyperitropeHEATED Debate w/ Feminists. Wage Gap, Pro… at 2:59:03

1 of 4

“Same thing but flips for your end. No offense. Whatever you guys have is invisible.”

— IslaperitropeHEATED Debate w/ Feminists. Wage Gap, Pro… at 2:19:05

Skōmmata (zingers)

The most quotable gibes, and each one scored on the Sophist ledger. Sharp, and beside the point.

1 of 4

“I believe that God has confirmed and blessed the choice of those books.”

— Pastor Pbegging the questionJay Dyer vs Pastor P Debate Orthodoxy vs… at 44:31

1 of 4

“That's you you got the mindset of a woman. Women believe in intuition.”

— Cooleyad hominem@deanwithrs Gets DESTROYED In Heated Debate… at 23:32

1 of 4

“That's a p and also not p. You just contradicted yourself. That's what I said. We just didn't understand what I No. I did understand what you just said. You you just said that the laws of logic is conceptual.”

— Cooleymisrepresentation@deanwithrs Gets DESTROYED In Heated Debate… at 19:12

Stoa of fallacies (hall of fallacies)

Every fallacy the referee has caught across all debates, ranked by how often it turns up, with the worst example of each.

misrepresentation

1 of 60

“Jay refuses to condemn Thomas Aquinas as a pedophile. That's shocking. I hope all the Christian listeners, especially the Protestants listening, note that these heretics, Sam and Jay, are down with pedophilia.” — Daniel Haqiqatjou
Religion Debate: Islam vs Christianity, watch at 2:40:29. All 60 instances

ad hominem

1 of 49

“I don't call you, like, a basement dwelling retard that looks like you smell bad and you haven't taken a shower in a month. ... If you're gonna throw me your TV, you should take a shower, retard.” — Austin Peterson
Debate MELTDOWN: Worst Opponent Yet: Austin…, watch at 1:13:28. All 49 instances

straw man

1 of 24

“I don't care about your definition of power.” — Jake the Muslim Metaphysician
HEATED DEBATE: Jay Dyer Vs Jake Muslim…, watch at 1:27:50. All 24 instances

dodge

1 of 17

“No. I don't. Because I think that shit's boring, bro.” — Austin Peterson
Debate MELTDOWN: Worst Opponent Yet: Austin…, watch at 57:36. All 17 instances

self-contradiction

1 of 16

“I can't [can] be arbitrary when I wanna be arbitrary. I can't [can do] whatever the fuck. ... It's not a it's not a hard debate format, so I can do whatever I want.” — Austin Peterson
Debate MELTDOWN: Worst Opponent Yet: Austin…, watch at 1:00:26. All 16 instances

begging the question

1 of 14

“I believe that God has confirmed and blessed the choice of those books.” — Pastor P
Jay Dyer vs Pastor P Debate Orthodoxy vs…, watch at 44:31. All 14 instances

hasty generalisation

1 of 11

“… every Protestant does this gnostic anti matter [anti-material] reading into these texts. I know I used to be a Protestant.” — Jay Dyer
FULL SAVAGE DEBATE: Jay Dyer Vs Indiana…, watch at 33:47. All 11 instances

non sequitur

1 of 10

“That's not my position. When did I ever say that I'm an empiricist? Well, if you're a nominalist, you're an empiricist.” — Jay Dyer
HEATED DEBATE: Jay Dyer Vs Jake Muslim…, watch at 1:15:41. All 10 instances

Recently judged All the agōnes

Bill: So-crates. The only true wisdom consists in knowing that you know nothing.
Ted: That's us, dude.
Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure, 1989